New Renegotiation Rule

[Guest]

I'm fine with it. But keep in mind that it's not easy to police, and not always easy to remember.

[Bigsmooth]

I'm fine with it. But keep in mind that it's not easy to police, and not always easy to remember.

I agree with this.

[aholbert]

I'm fine with it. But keep in mind that it's not easy to police, and not always easy to remember.

I seee your point but I disagree that its hard to remember. Its a pretty simple rule. If the player isnt in his last year...dont attempt to renegotiate with him. As far as policing, I'm willing to go by the honor code. In the end its just a game so I trust that people wont try to cheat to win in the OSFL.

I dont have the time to check every renegotiation to make sure that that it complies with the rules but I will do random checks. If someone breaks the rule, the contract will be voided. If someone is a repeat offender, they could lose draft picks or be removed from the league.

[nflchampion]

I'm fine with the rule change with one caveat. I don't think we should start enforcing the rule until after this season is over. If we do, the players who have already re-done their contracts (well within the rules as you add, commish) will gain somewhat of a competitive advantage. The rule is good, but we should start it at the end of the season.

(Admittedly, this is somewhat of a selfish post because I have been putting off renegotiations decisions until I get a better picture of how my players are doing, and this would probably screw that up pretty bad. Plus my team is terrible).

[aholbert]

I'm fine with the rule change with one caveat. I don't think we should start enforcing the rule until after this season is over. If we do, the players who have already re-done their contracts (well within the rules as you add, commish) will gain somewhat of a competitive advantage. The rule is good, but we should start it at the end of the season.

(Admittedly, this is somewhat of a selfish post because I have been putting off renegotiations decisions until I get a better picture of how my players are doing, and this would probably screw that up pretty bad. Plus my team is terrible).

That the plan. No in season rule changes. It will start at the end of the season.

[nouvelle_vague]

I dont care. I dont think it really makes much of a difference. Some leagues have that rule, some dont. My enjoyment level remains the same.

[Guest]

I seee your point but I disagree that its hard to remember.

It has been broken unintentionally in IHOF and WOOF at least three times in the fairly recent past. I'm convinced that in all three cases, they were telling the truth that they just plain forgot. It's likely to happen here as well.

[Clay]

My opinion is this and perhaps overly simplistic.... everyone can do it... everyone is aware of it... it's probably easier to just let it go than to police it.

[aholbert]

There has to be a balance between simplicity and realism for me to enjoy playing in this game or to stay in the league.

Lets be honest with the exception of Ben and Hoosier, the people who started this league and the majority of the people who joined this league at the beginning were newbies. We had no idea about any issues with the game and thats why the OSFL rules are really simplistic.

My biggest issue with this league and with the game is that owners (including myself) never have to make any tough decisions outside of who to draft and how much they want to offer a FA. I've seen one team in the 8 yrs of this league have salary cap issues and thats Phoenix and Phoenix only had them because they took on big contracts in order to make a championship run.

Another issue is the majority of our top FAs every year are from teams with absentee owners not from owners who had to make a decision about keeping or losing a FA. Why? Because owners can renegotiate like crazy. Look at Corey Lincoln:
<TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#f20008 border=3><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>TRANSACTIONS</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

<CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2008</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>2008</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>FA 1</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $22,910,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2009</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>2009</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>FA 1</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 3yrs, $33,590,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2010</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>2010</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>FA 1</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 3yrs, $16,070,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2011</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>2011</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>FA 1</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $7,240,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2012</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>2012</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Week 8</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#ffffff><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $17,630,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 width="100%" bgColor=#aaafb2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><CENTER>2013</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER><CENTER><TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#f20008 cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="10%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>2013</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Columbus</CENTER></TD><TD width="20%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Preseason Week 4</CENTER></TD><TD width="50%" bgColor=#e7e7e7><CENTER>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $10,740,000.</CENTER></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER>
He has signed a renegotiated deal EVERY YEAR. I'm not a sim crazy guy and I recognize that this is a game but when have you ever seen this happen in real life? Its not just Ben. Its me too. I can keep any player as long as I want under the current rules because I can always renegotiate.

As for policing it, I'm not. There isnt anything more than bragging rights on the line, so if someone wants to cheat just to win...thats pathetic and there will be consequences. To the point that Ben made, Im not naive enough to think that people wont make mistakes but the rule is pretty simple and straight forward so it isnt hard to follow. People said the same thing when we enacted the new FA rules last year and we had no issues last year.

[tarcone]

I cant.

[path12]

Doesn't matter either way for me as well.

[Guest]

It has been broken unintentionally in IHOF and WOOF at least three times in the fairly recent past. I'm convinced that in all three cases, they were telling the truth that they just plain forgot. It's likely to happen here as well.

I have to really agree with Ben here --- I'm in 4 leagues and I can't remember specific rules unless there is a huge neon sign on the message board --- even then I would probably miss it

[tarcone]

There has to be a balance between simplicity and realism for me to enjoy playing in this game or to stay in the league.

Lets be honest with the exception of Ben and Hoosier, the people who started this league and the majority of the people who joined this league at the beginning were newbies. We had no idea about any issues with the game and thats why the OSFL rules are really simplistic.

My biggest issue with this league and with the game is that owners (including myself) never have to make any tough decisions outside of who to draft and how much they want to offer a FA. I've seen one team in the 8 yrs of this league have salary cap issues and thats Phoenix and Phoenix only had them because they took on big contracts in order to make a championship run.

Another issue is the majority of our top FAs every year are from teams with absentee owners not from owners who had to make a decision about keeping or losing a FA. Why? Because owners can renegotiate like crazy. Look at Corey Lincoln:
<table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#f20008" border="3" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>TRANSACTIONS</center></td></tr></tbody></table>

<center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2008</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="10%"><center>2008</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>FA 1</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $22,910,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2009</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="10%"><center>2009</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>FA 1</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 3yrs, $33,590,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2010</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="10%"><center>2010</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>FA 1</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 3yrs, $16,070,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2011</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="10%"><center>2011</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>FA 1</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $7,240,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2012</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="10%"><center>2012</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="20%"><center>Week 8</center></td><td bgcolor="#ffffff" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $17,630,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" bgcolor="#aaafb2" border="0" bordercolor="#f20008" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><center>2013</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center><center><table style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="1" bordercolor="#f20008" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="10%"><center>2013</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>Columbus</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="20%"><center>Preseason Week 4</center></td><td bgcolor="#e7e7e7" width="50%"><center>Signed a renegotiated contract: 2yrs, $10,740,000.</center></td></tr></tbody></table></center>
He has signed a renegotiated deal EVERY YEAR. I'm not a sim crazy guy and I recognize that this is a game but when have you ever seen this happen in real life? Its not just Ben. Its me too. I can keep any player as long as I want under the current rules because I can always renegotiate.

As for policing it, I'm not. There isnt anything more than bragging rights on the line, so if someone wants to cheat just to win...thats pathetic and there will be consequences. To the point that Ben made, Im not naive enough to think that people wont make mistakes but the rule is pretty simple and straight forward so it isnt hard to follow. People said the same thing when we enacted the new FA rules last year and we had no issues last year.

Why is this a bad thing? If I draft a guy and develop him or have a couple good drafts and develop them, their contracts, realistically, could all come up at the same time and there is no way Im going to be able to keep all of them. So I did my homework and had a good draft. Then I committed the time to develop the player, possibly at the expense of wins. Now you get him?
As you stated this is only a game. And I like to draft and develop guys and watch them have great careers on my team. Then watch them retire on my team. That is a lot of the fun.

[aholbert]

Why is this a bad thing? If I draft a guy and develop him or have a couple good drafts and develop them, their contracts, realistically, could all come up at the same time and there is no way Im going to be able to keep all of them. So I did my homework and had a good draft. Then I committed the time to develop the player, possibly at the expense of wins. Now you get him?
As you stated this is only a game. And I like to draft and develop guys and watch them have great careers on my team. Then watch them retire on my team. That is a lot of the fun.

Its a bad thing if you are looking for any semblance of realism. If people want this league to become a league where the only thing that matters is the draft, then we can stay the course and not change a thing. What will happen (and what is happening) is that every other part of the game becomes simple. You can continue to renegotiate and keeep under the cap no matter who you sign or how much yu sign them for. We can have low talent FA pools like we had last year. We can hope that absentee owners will forget to resign their top players so that there is at least some talent in the FA pool.

For the past 4 yrs, almost every high level FA has been available because of absentee owners..not because owners were forced to make tough realistic choices about their team (The only exceptions I see are the years Gaylor and Ellard were top FAs) . I would love if every good player on my team stayed with my team forever but thats not realistic.

The more I dig into this, the more it looks like a glitch. We have people on multiple teams having their contracts renegotiated every year. Like I said before, I dont think I've seen this happen with any player in real life. Honestly, stuff like this kills the immersion factor and my enjoyment of the game. With that said, if the league is firmly against changing the rules, then I will keep the rules the same.

[aholbert]

Weve had more than a week's worth of discussion and so I'm going to make a ruling. Starting the beginning of next season, renegotiations will only be allowed with player's in the last year of their contracts.

We will use the honor code to monitor this rule meaning that I will trust each owner to abide by this rule. I will occasionally check to see that people are following the rule. For the first and second violation of the rule, the owner will be given a warning and the contract will be voided. On the third violation, the contract will be voided and the commisioner has the option to take a draft pick. On the fourth violation, a draft pick will be taken and the commissioner will consider removing the owner from the league.